[Stephen, who answers Marisa, is a student of Theosophy and Philosophy.]
Hello Marisa,
You wrote : " In addition if the present moment doesn't have a past or a future, God doesn't have a beginning nor an end."On the contrary, Marisa, it is said of God that he is the beginning and the end, the alpha and the omega.
And as one thinks, the past of a present thing designates where and how a thing begins to be. Its future designates that for what it is destined.
What do you think about this?
Stephen> "So God is the alpha and the omega; it means that God has a beginning and an end, therefore that God is destined to die and what about the question of eternity."
Marisa
It depends on the way that one understands the word "end". In the religious and philosophical languages the end is not associated directly to death. It rather designates what is finished, complete, whole, fully present.
Between the beginning and the end takes place the arrival in gradual.
It is this thought that is the origin of the linear conception of time, opposing to conceptions: cyclic and chaotic.
Christianity is founded on the hope that we evolve in the beginning (or in the moment), that God began and that we are destined to reach a certain shape of finality, symbolised by the celestial Jerusalem or paradise.
In short, the alpha and the omega let themselves be understood by the following question: the world that began (alpha) and in which one does evolve destines us to become what (omega)?
We speak of the present moment. We therefore evolve in any one moment. Although we are present in the moment, this moment is already present in itself.
There is:
1 - The presence of the moment
2 - Our presence in this moment
1 - what makes present the moment
2 - what makes us present in this moment
The lost sense of the word "God" is a game between these two elements.
God is both the initiator of a moment or of one time and the initiator of that that evolves inside this time.
This divine science requires that one asks a first question: In what consists the divine moment in which one evolves?
What characterizes this moment? What is the sense of this time? What is the divine plan? It is necessary, to discover it, to try to put in light the "signs of times". What is that "sign of times"?
These questions are important because the knowledge of the presence of the moment, of what makes present the moment in which one evolves, of its cause, contains the key to understand this world, which is the key to know where it is necessary to go, in conformity with the spiritual destiny of this world.
Stephen> If I understand well, the alpha and the omega are the Source (God as ONE). From there we divided, as cells of the human body in beings that divided to their essence in two poles: the masculine and the feminine (souls). We must return to the source, after having experimented all shapes of existence that were necessary to evolve (karma = cyclic time) and to recover our other half to recover us as beings endowed each with an individual soul. I like the picture where we owe Siamese souls becoming twin souls.
> We live on this earth with an ego (what is the difference between the ego and the soul and also between the ego and the mental and the ego and the Nab [Note]?) The Nab and the mental belong at the cyclic time (clock), the soul at the linear time, it is this time that one calls the present time, the one that doesn't belong to the past nor the future. It is time, or so it seems, that frees us of all that is passed (karma). Jesus understood it and it is by this means that he reached immortality.
Marisa
[Note: The distorted ego, like others call it, I name it the NAB. It is an aspect of our being that doesn't want to face the necessary interior changes, that lie to us, that mislead us, that chooses the easy path, that manipulates us to think that we don't have to change anything, that tells us that we are on the right path, always the easy one, the path that refuses the effort that would save it of its own destruction, that escapes the choices of the soul: its desires of perfection, achievement, knowledge, unity and fullness.
Am I going to call it ostrich, blackness, unconsciousness, perfidy, silliness? I decided to call it Nab tea, from has French word " nabab " which is person who spreads out his wealth.
The NAB is this aspect of our personality that flees, lies, manipulates, that chooses misplacement as a lifestyle, that stagnates in us and that wants to take us to the death of our spiritual and divine aspirations.]
Marisa wrote:
> So God is the alpha and the omega; it means that God has a beginning and an end, therefore that God is destined to die and what about the question of eternity.
Ah ! Marisa, not so.
God always was, is everything that there is, and will always be. All is God. In this sense, he is the beginning of all, the middle of all and the end of all, since there is nothing but him.But words delimit a concept whereas the concept doesn't have an end. God is. All. Everywhere. Eternal.
If you think in terrestrial terms, the beginning and the end are delimited. But if you think in spiritual, divine terms, there is only God. The Alpha and the Omega are of terms that describe the infinity, without fencing it, without limit.
The ordinary human mind, the mental, cannot conceive infinity. In order to know, one has to experience infinity, to experience God.
At night, look at the sky. You will be able to count stars there, those that you see. But there are hundreds of billions of stars. With their instruments scientists counted hundreds of millions of stars and they didn't see the end of it. They always invent more perfected instruments and continue to discover things.
And that, Marisa, is only God's visible part. There is no end to infinity.
Pierre> Hello Pierre,
> Hello everyone,
> Therefore God doesn't have a beginning nor an end since he is eternal. The alpha and the omega don't have anything to do with terrestrial time (cyclic, timetable).
> Even if the present instant has nothing to do with hourly time, it doesn't mean that it is static. One can travel in time, while living the present instant, but it doesn't serve anything that I worry about tomorrow, since tomorrow is part of the my future and I live now. What happened does not exist anymore, it is not part of the now. I can remember of my past without it affecting my present and my future doesn't exist since when I arrive in the " future " I am all over again in the present; therefore the future doesn't exist, it is a mental conception that serves to situate us on the terrestrial plan.
> Marisa
Hello Marisa,
Marisa wrote:
> If I understand correctly, the alpha and the omega are the Source (God as ONE). From there, we divided ourselves,We didn't divide ourselves, Marisa. Takes a glass, in appearance empty. There is air in it. Air is composed of atoms. Atoms between them are not divided. They recognize themselves, each, as being atoms, being part of the space.
So it is with the Spirits of God. There is no division, but recognition. God's Spirits recognized themselves, individually and collectively, to be God.
It is only later (60 billions years after awakening - terrestrial time) that God's Spirits, here on Earth, separated themselves in two poles to become twin souls.
> as cells of the human body into beings that divided in two poles, masculine and feminine (souls). We must return to the source, after having experimented all shapes of existence ",
Not all shapes of existence. We don't need to experiment the rock, air, the tree, metal or water, since we, Spirits of God, created them.
> that were necessary for us to evolve (karma = cyclic time) and to recover our other half to recover us as beings each endowed with an individual soul. I like the picture where of Siamese souls we become twin souls.
> Do we live on this earth with an ego (what is the difference between the ego and the soul and also between the ego and the mental and the ego and the Nab?)
How is it, Marisa, that you still don't you know the difference? We often spoke of that.
The " I " is used both by the ego and by the spirit. " I " is part of the human nature (ego) and of the divine nature (spirit/soul).
The mental is human nature. The Nab is instinctive nature. The Nab lives to gratify itself in every way it can. It is the selfish in the being.
> The nab and the mental belong to the cyclic time (clock), the soul at the linear time, it is this time that one calls the present time, the one that doesn't belong to the past nor the future ".The soul belongs at all times. It has a past (karma) and a present (the soul answers to the karmic situations). Besides, it prepares its future (that depends what it does, every day.)
> It is, it seems, time that frees us of all the past (karma).
It is not time that frees us, but our voluntary, daily actions.
> Jesus understood this and it is by this means that he reached immortality ".
Jesus did what he had to do, him that remembered his mission and accomplished it.
It is not that I need or enjoy to complicate things, Marisa, but> So God is the alpha and the omega; it means that God has a beginning and an end, therefore that God is destined to die and what about the question of eternity.
> Even if the present instant has nothing to do with hourly time, it doesn't mean that it is static. One can travel in time, while living the present instant, but it doesn't serve anything that I worry about tomorrow, since tomorrow is part of the my future and I live now. What happened does not exist anymore, it is not part of the now.
What happened exists in your memory, Marisa. If you remember of certain moments of your past, you can feel the previously expressed emotions again.
You remember smiles, passed loves, emotions. All this lives in you, in the present. This is not the past. This lives in you, in the present, every time that you remember.
> " I can remember my past but it will not affect my present "If you remember the past of this life and all your pasts (previous incarnations), it will affect your present, because you will take decisions, from the knowledge of what happened.
> and my future doesn't exist since when I arrive in the " future " I am all over again in the present, therefore the future doesn't exist, it is a mental conception that serves to situate us on the terrestrial " plan.
The future is a projection of the spirit. Starting from there, it exists in a state of idea. However, we are creators. It is while projecting our ideas in the " continuum " that we created the universe.Pierre
Stephen wrote:Hello every one,
Marisa wrote:
> "The Nab and the mental belong to cyclic time (clock), the soul to the linear, what we call the present time, the one that does not belong to the past or the future."
It is difficult to say what in us, belongs strictly at one precise time of that God began, and that that doesn't belong at any precise time, therefore, to eternity (beyond all alphas and omegas).I know that the human body, for example, only belongs to earth's time, because when I die my body goes to earth.
When it comes to the Nab, to the mind, to the soul, that is another problem.
Do these elements relate to a particular story? Don't they have a sense only in a precise story? Or are they common to all stories that God began? These questions overwhelms me.
Pierre sustains that the soul belongs at all times. Therefore, it is the same soul that chooses to evolve in the different histories that God began. It is very possible. Since we are God, it is necessary that a part of oneself is preserved for eternity. One can call this part " soul ".
Marisa also wrote :
> " It seems that time frees us from our past (karma). "The time frees something. When a time begins, this last frees the space available to let occur in it other beings.
So one speaks of a " space-time " setting. Time only frees one thing: space.
And about what frees us of one particular time, this is not time himself, but us that, as Pierre says, choose to free ourselves of this particular time.
To summarize, when one says that God is the alpha and the omega, it doesn't mean that God has a beginning and an end, but that he is the origin of everything that begins and that continues until its finish.
The world in which we live is not considered, in Genesis, as The beginning of the divine, but like a beginning that the divine began.
The alpha and the omega designate the time that God created and in which we evolve.
We evolve in one precise temporal fashion, that means in one " particular moment ". This particular moment is conceived so that we lived, inside this one, a particular experience.
The alpha and the omega serve to designate limits of this time. But that is it necessary to understand by this word " limits "? Actually, the word "limit" means that between which something occurs. The limit is the contour that puts in evidence what comes out in this contour.
Alpha and Omegas are indeterminate, infinite words, that ask to receive, after a good research, features of this contour that put in evidence what one is (omega) from where one comes out again (alpha).
I don't undermine, by this use of the word " limits ", God's infinite aspect. What is infinite, is not inside time in which one evolves. That time is very well delimited. What is infinite, I underlined it, is that God can lead to several beginnings. God didn't begin one day to end another day. He is, on the contrary, the one that is free to give out, in infinite ways, beginnings to all worlds.
> Therefore God doesn't have beginning nor and end since he is eternal. The alpha and the omega don't have anything to do with terrestrial time (cyclic, timetable).
Indeed, God doesn't have a beginning nor and end. In this, he is eternal and infinite.
On the other hand, God is the one that gives place to beginnings (alpha). These beginnings are destined (omega) to permit us to experiment, in precise and limited settings, as the one of the planet, our divine nature.
What is limited are the times, the settings in which we evolve.
What is unlimited, is the liberty that God has to create all the settings he wishes. God doesn't limit himself to a precise setting, he is the origin of all possible settings, which is one of his infinite aspects.
I think that the alpha and the Omega have something to do with terrestrial time. Terrestrial time is a time that God began so that we evolved inside limits of this time.
To really know the goal of this time, it would be necessary to wonder: why has this time we evolve in started?
Since terrestrial time began, one can speak of it like an alpha. Since this time was begun so that angels can live, of this one, a precise experience, one can speak of this time like an omega. Thus, Alpha and Omega are not terms that limit God, but rather the time that God began.
When Jesus says he is the alpha and the Omega, he testifies of the knowledge he has of terrestrial time. He knows, while naming the alpha, what made this world begin and he knows, while naming the Omega, why that world began.
The present instant, it is not I that am present somewhere in a world. The instant designates a time directly among so many others that God began. We evolve in instants. Among these instants, there is the " terrestrial ". Instead of saying " terrestrial time " one could say " terrestrial moment " or " terrestrial instant " or " terrestrial setting ".
The present instant means the particular moment of which inside one evolves. To succeed in qualifying the presence of this moment, it's answering the enigma of the alpha and the Omega (Who began this world? Why does this world have begun?)
We live in the present instant, that means that we evolve in the instant that God made present for us. The present instant is therefore in relation with something that characterizes the terrestrial time in which one occurs.
As for the idea about travel in time, one can say that one moves inside the precise time where one evolves. In this sense one can travel in the time while staying in a same time, in a same instant.
Stephen